Is this the "Thermorossi" or the "Italian" attitude? I sure hope the former. These guys shame Italy itself!

This is the continuation of my Thermorossi saga. To see how it started, please read the first blog post.
 
It is now time to narrate the email exchange with the Thermorossi factory.

I started the email exchange after I received the supposedly checked-out-fine remote control and still being unable to use it, after the distributor declined to send an advance replacement unit due to factory policy. For anyone interested I can forward the original SMTP messages.

I am posting this because this is the most amazing attitude that I have seen in my life. Is this the "Thermorossi" or the "Italian" attitude? I sure hope the former. These guys shame Italy itself!

For those bored to read all this, in my emails I describe my view that they sell an expensive device which can really only be controlled via its single remote control. Since, this is clearly an unacceptable design fault, they should amend it by providing a second, backup, wired or wireless control, which would enable basic control of the device (pellet flow and fan strength) in case the primary fails, without obliging the user to hurt his arm in his effort to find and reach a single non-visible button on the back of the device, after first pulling it out of its niche. Furthermore, since I have had my fireplace for two months without being able to use it for more than two weeks, all this in the middle of the winter, that they should send me an advance replacement unit.

The result: ridicule, mockery and insult. Its is evident that these people, apart from bad engineering, have absolutely no knowledge of customer support.
 
1st message from me, Jan 31, 2013

Sirs,

I have recently purchased a Thermorossi Insert 60 pellet fireplace. It is a well designed and good quality device, but I have a major complaint. About 2 weeks ago my remote control broke down and I realized that without it I could not operate my fireplace! The single insert on/off and flame adjustment button in the back of the fireplace (where it is very difficult to reach) is in my opinion not enough for basic operation of the fireplace. You should have placed the minimum controls needed to operate the fireplace on a drawer or a panel on the front of the insert. Alternatively, you should provide a second simpler wired or wireless control for that purpose, in case the primary remote control breaks down. I think that an expensive and quality device like the Insert 60 should at the least have such a provision.

Kindly inform me if you can provide me with a second simple backup remote control, for free or a small fee. I think that my complaint and request is reasonable and that you should grant it.

Thank you.

Sincerely,

Dionysis 

1st reply from the factory, Jan 31, 2013

Good afternoon,

please contact the dealer by which you purchased the unit,

they will check the fault of the remote control and get back to

us.

Regards

Nicola Menegozzo

2nd message from me, Jan 31, 2013

Hello and thank you for the responce.

I have contacted the dealer and he repaired the control. The problem was apparently a faulty wire. However, apart from the bad manufacturing quality, I'd like to stress again that the insert is not adequately controllable without a remote control. This is unacceptable, in my opinion, for a good quality and expensive unit. I was unable to operate it for almost two weeks, in the middle of winter. As such, I regard this problem a bad design problem and I am asking you to amend this by providing a second, simpler if needed, remote control for the smooth operation of the unit in case the one and only remote control you provide with it is not operating.

This will show that you care for the usability of your design and for the satifaction of your customers.

Sincerely,

Dionysis 

3rd message from me, Feb 15, 2013

Sirs,

It has been two weeks since the last email I sent you and I don’t have a response.

I think that Thermorossi try its best to satisfy its customers’ requests and at least respond to them.

It is highly inappropriate for a good quality product and company to not have proper customer support, as well as to have fundamental faults, such as the one I describe, in its design. Furthermore, it is very bad to build a reputation of being insensitive and uncaring to customers’ problems and requests.

So, I’d like to repeat again that, due to a faulty remote control, I have not been able to use my Insert 60 for three weeks in the middle of winter and that, since you have not built onto the device enough controls for full manual operation, you are obliged to provide a second, wired or wireless, remote control for this purpose.

Sincerely,

Dionysis  
2nd reply from the factory, Feb 18, 2013

Good morning,

your feedback will be forwarded to the technical and design department.

The unit can be easily controlled by a small red button on the back of main power

board also when the remote control is not working.

We are sorry to inform you that it is not possible to supply you with a second remote control.

Kind Regards

Nicola Menegozzo

4th message from me, Feb 19, 2013

Sirs,

Thank you for the (late) response.

I am well aware of the backside button. However, it is my opinion that the device is NOT controllable from this single button. It is not enough for basic operation and it is not easily reachable (my arm hurts from the effort to use it, especially when shuting the device down).

Furthermore, my original remote control is still broken, after comming back from your distributor. They supposedly checked it, but trying to use it showed that it cannot charge, although the charger does provide power. Eventually the batteries were depleted and the remote shut down.

Now I again cannot use the insert (I consider the backside button useless) and I am very very annoyed both by you, the distributor and the seller.

If you do not ASAP send me a replacement remote control and a second one as a backup, I shall start a campaign against you, describing my story, to every single forum, site and blog, inside Greece and internationally. Furthermore I am going to file a complaint against you and your distributor to the local consumer protection authorities for not honoring the device's warranty.

I am giving you one week from today.

Sincerely,

Dionysis 

3rd reply from the factory, Feb 19, 2013

Good morning,

thank you very much for this juicy mail, or I should better say black mail.

No matters, this will be forwarded obviously to the legal department.

At the beginning I was quite of the idea that I could try to find an arrangement with

the local dealer and the distributor (that still haven't been mentioned in this

correspondance) in order to have the problem solved once for all.

Now, as obviously the situation is quite chanced as you decided to use blackmails,

you only have one solution, which is the one that is according to European warranty standards and

norms: you can bring or send the "defective" remote control to the dealer together with a document in which

there is well described model of the stove, serial nr., purchasing date, details on malfunction, official purchasing

invoice. The "defective" part will be send to our laboratories to make all tests (for example to check that the

eventual malfunction is not depending by the fact that the remote dropped from your hands...). Once the test

will be completed and warranty case confirmed, our distributor will be supplied with 1 new remote control

that will be consequently supplied to you. 

From this moment afterwards I must advise that all correspondece will be archived and forwared to legal

department.

"If you do not ASAP send me a replacement remote control and a second one as a backup, I shall start a campaign against you, describing my story, to every single forum, site and blog, inside Greece and internationally"  I hope you are fully aware of what you are writing considering that we are speaking about a product that comes with official EN Certiciation with thousands of units sold, and  for this reason you are ready to take all responsibilities in front of an official legal international court.

"Furthermore I am going to file a complaint against you and your distributor to the local consumer protection authorities for not honoring the device's warranty", I also can imagine here that you are fully aware of European Warranty Norms, so you are completely sure that it is not necessary to send back defective parts for tests before getting a replacement under warranty and will also in this case take full responsibility of what is written here.

Must be clear that from my side I was open to find an accomodating solution also if your complaints are based on a design and manufacturing aspect that sounds really strange considering that there is a complete team of engineers and designers who cares of the development of units that are all approved according to more restrictive European Norms, and in particular this unit is on the market from many years with excellents feedbacks.

Now, I remind once again, that we are open to solve the problem, but after your blackmail  ONLY according to EN Warranty policy, that means internal check up of the defective part, check up of documentation, and eventual replacement or reparation.

You will find attached a form that you can easily fill and deliver to the local dealer together with the defective part. Usually this form is for dealers and distributors, but as you never mentioned where and when you purchased the unit I cannot forward to nobody else than you.

I will wait for documentation and updates from the dealer who took care of the sale,

Have a good day,

Regards

Nicola Menegozzo

5th message from me, Feb 19, 2013

Sir,

I have not seen any real willingness to help from you. I sent you my second email describing my problem 31/1 and you replied 18/2 without offering any sympathy to my inability to use the device.

You mention european norms and standards, engineers and design teams. Instead you should hear your customers more. And I as a customer how has paid for an expensive and important device, all I known is that I've had a defective remote control, which I only had a chance to use for 3 or 4 times before it broke down. I also know that I have never in my life seen another, admitedly otherwise well made product, that cannot easily be controlled without a remote control. The backside button is NOT usable.

Furthermore, it is my undisputed and inalienable right to freely express my opinion and experience with a product publicly and you cannot challenge this at any court. Even if you attempt to do that, you cannot change the facts. The device is not usable without a remote control.

As for the distributor, his name is Lazarou. The seller's and installer's name is Adamopoulos.

So to sum it up, I have every right to truthfully express and publish my experience and to file complaints to consumer protection authorities about a product. And I have every intention to so, unless you send me two, I repeat two, remote controls, one as a replacement to the defective (which I will return to the distributor) and a second as a backup, due to the unusablitity of the device without a remote control.

Sincerely,

Dionysis 

4th reply from the factory, Feb 19, 2013

As comfirmed in my last mail, I only wait for documentation and defective part from Lazarou.

The best thing you can do is to supply the form (that now you find attached) completely filled

together with the defective piece.

Once we will be able to check the part here by our laboratories it will be checked if there is a malfunction that will be covered by warranty,

and consequently 1 new remote will be sent.

The faster you do this the faster you will be supplied with a new remote.

Obviously you can write whatever you want whereever you prefer, as you did untill now here.

And obviously we can decide to take any action against unprope slander campaigns, we have a legal department that works on this.

By the time being to make resume of the matter, untill now the situation is that you complain for design and manufacturing failure for a unit approved with report nr 400186 from Kiwa Gastec made on december 2009 according to EN14785:2006 and you advance warranty case claim without having previously supplied any documentation and the defective part for check up.

These are the facts untill now. All other things that you wrote here or you will write somewhere else unfortunately have no confirmation untill any documentation will be supplied.

Referring the thing that we have answered late, I think you should better read again this correspondence. The same day you sent the mail to info we answered to contact the official dealer in order to proceed with warranty case. In my opinion it should be one of the most obvious things, or when yo have problems with your Tv do you call directly Sony in Japan?

So I am sorry but you are wrong, we were, and I underline were, completely willing to solve your problem in the shortest and more accomodating way possible, but as you decide to go ahead with blackmails the only option you have now is to follow standard warranty procedure after contacting our distributor. That is anyway a teandard procedure to solve warranty cases, it doesn't mean we do not take care of this as you hint at.

So now I think I was definitely clear enough. You have all instruments and options how to proceed and you are free to act as you prefer.

Once again, have a nice day...

P.S  I put Lazarou in copy, so they will be aware of the full correspondence and will be ready to act once you get back to them with documentation and the part. 

Nicola Menegozzo

6th message from me, Feb 19, 2013

Sir.

Instead of "punishing" me for my "threat" to publish the true facts of your product to possible customers of yours (which I have every right to do and you will never be able to prove malice and slander on my part), you should consider immediately sending me an advance replacement, with or without the Larazou's participation.

I've had the device for two months and in the middle of the winter I haven't been able to use it for more than two weeks.

From my part I took the time to send the remote to your distributor, who supposedly checked it and found it OK. However, it still does not work (it does not charge). I have done all I am willing to do as a customer.

Obviously you value approvals, standards and formal processes more than customer's complains or problems.

As far as communication is concerned the transcript is as follows:

31/1-10:03 - Initial email from me stating the design problem

31/1-10:52 - First reply from you indicating that I should contact the dealer (no mention on the design problem)

31/1-20:01 - Second email from me, restating the design problem and confirming that I already have sent the remote to the distributor (Lazarou) and requesting a second remote from you.

15/2-11:53 - Still no reply from you. Third email from me repeating (politely) my points and requests.

18/2-10:08 - Second reply from you (three weeks after my second email), not showing any willingness to help.

19/2-11:04 - Third email from me, restating my problem, my requests and the "threats".

If you call these willingness to help, then you give new definition to it.

Incidentally, I have contacted Sony (Europe) and had much better responce about a TV that is much cheaper than your insert.

I suggest that you restructure both you design and customer support departments and that you put away all "hurt" feelings and respond to my requests like a proper European manufacturer should.

I close this letter with the wish to not have any further responses from you, the hope that with such an uncaring manufacturer I will not have any more problems with the fireplace and that reminder that for a week I shall do nothing but wait for a replacement remote control.

Sincerely,

Dionysis

5th reply from the factory, Feb 19, 2013

Good afternoon,

this is my last answer becasue I have no more time for this, you can be sure don't worry.

I put the matter on another way, perhaps easier to understand also from your side, last attempt.

Let's start from the first questions:

Who are you?

Do you have any direct commecial deal with Thermorossi Spa?

Did you get any material directly from Thermorossi Spa?

Do you have any documentation to support your request of warranty replacement?

Start answering yourself to this questions, than start thinking about this, and ask yourself if you were in our

position if you would send replacement pcs for free without having the minimum detail about the story and NO direct deal.

If you don't understand that I don't know who you are and you think I should send you

not one but two pcs of remote controls without the minimum idea of who you are and any details

about what and when you have purchased I think you are really in the wrong direction, and you will have

to wait the pcs for a little bit longer than one week.

I really find it funny that you don't understand this, anyway maximum respect for you opinions, you are responsible for your actions and words.

I do not comment all things about customer care policy because it really makes no sense to discus about this with

you in these circumstances.

I underline once again and for the last time that the aim was to find a common solution, but you decided to put the matter

on another way with you inconvenient and unpleasant blackmails.

Really hoping to receive no more ridicolous and annoying mails from you, I suggest once again to contact Lazarou and follow

the warranty replacement procedure, on the contrary I wish you pleasant time waiting the pcs coming from Italy.

Sincerely

Nicola Menegozzo

7th and final message from me, Feb 19, 2013

Sir,

I had decided not to communicate with you again.

Howerver, having received your last email though I have to say that I am delighted that, instead of communicating with your distributor to confirm my writings, you chose to accuse me of being an impostor (presumably to get a couple of free remote controls from you to use them with my TV and aircondition).

I am delighted because I am sure that the local consumer protection authorities and the readers of forums, blogs and review sites will be interested to know of your comments, ridicule and accusations against me, as well as the time and means it took you to respond.

They will be very interested to know how you reacted, instead of facing and remediating two simple facts: a) you sell an expensive device that is not really usable without a remote control and b) you have absolutely no knowledge of customer support and proper behaviour to customers.

I must say that in the beginning I was just hoping for a quick fix of my remote. After your insults however, nothing short of written apology and two remotes will stop me from publishing everything.

Sincerely,

Dionysis